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zebra midges

 
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mcgurtis



Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 23
Location: Farmington

PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 1:07 pm    Post subject: zebra midges Reply with quote

An open question.....When tying zebra midges, do you typically tie with or without beads? I see them in the fly shops both ways. Sometimes I tie some crystal flash as a little wing off the top. Is there a right way and a wronge way, or are they called different things.
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FishnPreach



Joined: 19 Aug 2008
Posts: 27
Location: Paluxy Texas

PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 2:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They are called different names because they are definitely imitating different stages of the life cycle. See Mike Mora's recipes for tying these here http://www.ifly4trout.com/flypatterns.htm

When I tie the zebra midge pattern, I will definitely tie 3 types primarily. Those without the kf top and wing, those with, and then I will tie some with the clear glass bead. Size 18 and smaller. There was a time when I wouldn't have believed that a size 22 or 24 zebra with or without that kf wing would make a difference, until one day I was floating with a well known guide and I happened to have the midge with the wing on and the guy floating with me didn't. It just happened the trout were keying in to the midge emergers with the kf wing and I hooked up with a half dozen before he figured out what the difference was and changed. Immediately he started getting hookups.

Lesson learned, have some of each type in your box, as well as tying them in different colors. This is easily one of my favorites on the SJ. RS2 being second.

Hopes this helps.
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Ryno



Joined: 27 Mar 2008
Posts: 39

PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 2:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree w/ FishnPreach that they are 2 different flies. They imitate 2 different parts of the midge's lifecylce: pupa stage (no flash) and emerger stage (flash).

In terms of beads, I generally stay away from using beads on the Juan, even though I've had success on other rivers using midge imitations w/ beads. There is one exception, however: I have had sucess in the past with tying a "gun metal" bead on a size 24 black zebra midge.

Laughing
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Ryno


Last edited by Ryno on Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:30 pm; edited 1 time in total
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FishnPreach



Joined: 19 Aug 2008
Posts: 27
Location: Paluxy Texas

PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 3:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The glass bead midge is definitely not my first choice. Considering the fact that the glass bead is there to only imitate the gas bubbles which form to help the midge rise the surface it is as far as I am aware impossible to determine if and when that might be occurring.

Mike Mora's pattern here http://www.ifly4trout.com/flypatterns/glass_eye_midge.htm is the pattern I duplicate. The first time I ever fished the SJ I heard this fly mentioned as the GEM, and have always tied a few as a last resort.

The gunmetal bead midge--recipe here--http://www.ifly4trout.com/flypatterns/gun_metal_emergers.htm is the pattern Ryno is refering to. It can be very deadly as well.
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mcgurtis



Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 23
Location: Farmington

PostPosted: Sun Aug 24, 2008 12:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you all for the responces. sometimes I get ahead of myself and start imitating fly's I see in fly shops rather than imitating Fly's from the river. From your comments I realized what I was doing and am changing my evil ways. I think the pressure of my first bi-fly tourney had my head spinning. It was very satisfying to catch fish on my own fly's when people were having little luck around me.
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Midgeaholic



Joined: 02 Jan 2007
Posts: 123
Location: Albuquerque

PostPosted: Mon Aug 25, 2008 9:28 am    Post subject: Standard patterns vs your own Reply with quote

I tend to be a bit of a maverick when it comes to tying for the SJ it comes with the years of fishing the river. Because of my breach of using standard SJ patterns I have arrived at my personal collection of patterns which frees me from carrying scads of boxes with scads of patterns. I usually wear a guide shirt with two fly patches and two very small streamworks boxes in my pockets. I have yet to run into a situation that I was not prepared for. This works on the Green as well as other western tail waters. The secret is that I have learned to personalize and style my fly patterns. midgeaholic
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cliftoma



Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 47
Location: Navajo Dam, NM

PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2008 9:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Different times, different patterns. There have been times when all they would eat was the bead wing midge. At other, they like the KF.

Come prepared. Unless you have somebody reliable to key you in on the good combos, just mix and match until you find the right combo. The first day is usually trial and error, but you figure it out. The second day you nail it.
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Ken Roberts



Joined: 05 Jan 2007
Posts: 36

PostPosted: Mon Nov 17, 2008 11:43 am    Post subject: Zebra midges Reply with quote

Hi Midgeaholic,
when on the river do you use netting to see what's in the water? And at what depth?
If so what kind of netting and any advise on use would be gratefully received.
Thanks, Ken.
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Midgeaholic



Joined: 02 Jan 2007
Posts: 123
Location: Albuquerque

PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 3:41 pm    Post subject: netting for specimens Reply with quote

Yes Ken, I carry a small scooping net(the kind you find at the pet shop) that attaches to my wading staff. Like I wrote in my post I have been working at carrying as little as possible but, I find that netting is essential in finding out what is below the surface film. I also have one small specimen bottle. Tightlines midgeaholic.
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wogger



Joined: 01 Jan 2008
Posts: 48
Location: Western Colorado

PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 9:07 am    Post subject: Nets Reply with quote

Ken,

I use a straining net that you can pick up for free at any paint store. It is a net for straining paint from 5 gallon buckets. It fits perfectly over any fish net that you carry.

That is the best way to check for bugs. I see people killing fish all of the time using stomach pumps. That is the worst device that I see on the river.

Wogger
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Paul Zimmerman aka Wogger

Nothing Makes a Fish Bigger Than Almost Being Caught!
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Fly2Fish



Joined: 23 Sep 2007
Posts: 35
Location: Missouri City, Texas

PostPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2008 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wogger,

I agree with you about stomach pumps, but I guess those who like them will argue that by examining the contents of a fish's stomach you know for sure what it's been eating, whereas seining for bugs doesn't really tell you if the trout are eating that particular bug. However, I'd say that first you'd have to catch the fish before you could examine its stomach contents, and if I was already catching fish, I'd know what they were eating anyway. I know a pretty good guide on the SJ who uses stomach pumps; he says if used properly (i.e., use the pump to gently flush water down the fish's throat into the stomach to flush out some of what it's been eating) it shouldn't hurt the fish, but I wonder how many regular fly-fishers actually know how to properly use it.

Anyway, your suggestion of a paint strainer is a good one; wish I'd thought of it before I bought a Wind River Quick Seine to stretch over my net.
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